I used to think it was awful that life was so unfair. Then I thought, 'wouldn't it be much worse if life *were* fair, and all the terrible things that happen to us come because we actually deserve them?' So now I take great comfort in the general hostility and unfairness of the universe. – M. Cole
Not So Polite Dinner Conversation – wannabee nazis and confederates are soooooo stupid
Now, we have morons burning the Nike apparel because Nike paid Kaepernick to represent them. I am all for the kneeling in protest of bigotry, ignorance and pure stupidity when it comes to so many people in law enforcement being idiots when it comes to black men. Not all law enforcement officers are stupid, and that means most of them, but when it comes to more than one a week of someone being a damn fool with a weapon, then it’s an issue.
We also have idiots who are claiming to support other shoe companies because they have athletic shoes with the US flag on them. Now, lest we forget, that isn’t supposed to happen and these wannabee white supremacists don’t even what the US Flag Code says, and heck most of them want to fly a flag with a swastika on it or the battle flag of a country that decided to kill their fellow citizens because they wanted to own people and allow people to own other people in the new territories.
This is what the flag code says “The flag should never have placed upon it, nor on any part of it, nor attached to it any mark, insignia, letter, word, figure, design, picture, or drawing of any nature.
(h) The flag should never be used as a receptacle for receiving, holding, carrying, or delivering anything.
(i) The flag should never be used for advertising purposes in any manner whatsoever. It should not be embroidered on such articles as cushions or handkerchiefs and the like, printed or otherwise impressed on paper napkins or boxes or anything that is designed for temporary use and discard. Advertising signs should not be fastened to a staff or halyard from which the flag is flown.
(j) No part of the flag should ever be used as a costume or athletic uniform. However, a flag patch may be affixed to the uniform of military personnel, firemen, policemen, and members of patriotic organizations. The flag represents a living country and is itself considered a living thing. Therefore, the lapel flag pin being a replica, should be worn on the left lapel near the heart. “
And when this shoe is worn out, it will be tossed as trash, with diapers, rotten tomatoes, cigarette buts, etc.
My husband, brother and father served. They don’t find a shoe that ignores the flag code to be supporting them at all. Indeed, it just shows that the people who want no one to ever mention that there is such a thing as white privilege and that there are severe problems with racism are terribly ignorant about what the US stands for, including the flag. Kneeling shows respect to the flag; sweating into it, stomping around on it, certainly doesn’t.
Lots of claims of patriotism from people who don’t know US code, who fly flags of enemies of the US, who have no problem with immigrants who honorably served this country being thrown out, and who have no problem with a president who cut funds for veterans and pay to the military, and who want to go back to the bad ol’ days where racism was okay. One would think that they do have to claim to be patriots since they don’t do a thing that would make you think they are.
Oh, and to add to the stupidity, one of the most poor and stupid of the southern states, Alabama, has a law that will allow a spousal rapist to sue his victim if they want to get an abortion and the parents or legal guardians can force an underage woman to have a child she doesn’t want. Now, let’s just see what happens if man of color tries this with a Caucasian victim. The south should have become a protected area and never forgiven for what it chose to do.
25 thoughts on “Not So Polite Dinner Conversation – wannabee nazis and confederates are soooooo stupid”
I might be wrong (I often am) but didn’t the USA Olympic Teams wear a flag symbol on their kit? Also the USA National Soccer Team? I didn’t know that there was a ‘Flag Code’. Boy, that’s weird!
it isn’t unusual for people to have no idea about the code. But one would think that these uberpatriots would know especially since they know about the flag burning part. And pretty much at any conservative rally, some idiot has a flag shirt, flag halter top, etc on .
While I agree the reaction to Nike’s decision is at best misguided, there are things I might point out . . .
Not everyone who disagrees with “taking the knee” is a white supremacist and implying so does a disservice to the many persons of color who — for their own reasons — don’t agree with disrespecting a flag, including not standing during the anthem.
What’s at the heart of the discussion for them is the method, time, and place of the protest and not so much discounting the issue itself.
I know, I know . . . it’s convenient lumping everything together as it cuts down having to understand and discuss the many issues related to the original controversy.
Second, you mention the Flag Code, but you might have provided the link (http://www.usflag.org/uscode36.html) and perhaps point out this oft-overlooked fact:
*While the Code empowers the President of the United States to alter, modify, repeal or prescribe additional rules regarding the Flag, no federal agency has the authority to issue ‘official’ rulings legally binding on civilians or civilian groups.*
Little more than a “suggestion” to civilians, the code is strictly enforced by the armed forces within the armed forces and thus their negative reactions to the misuse of the flag or disrespect aimed at the flag — by no means universal — is certainly not because they are “nazis” or white supremacists.
So it is with the burning of Nike shoes; it’s done for different reasons by different people. Yes, it’s stupid if for no other reason that there are homeless people who could use those shoes and many of those homeless are, in fact, veterans.
While I’m not big on any of these demonstrations, I do recognize that when people feel strongly about something, they want to “do” something.
How that something is received will vary depending on the views of the person who chooses to pay attention . . . and most people have a narrow attention span driving them to over-react about everything. A perfect brew for irrational temper-flaring on both sides of . . . well, I’m not sure what, really; like I said, many issues at play here and one never knows what an individual is actually paying attention to.
Personally, I do what I think we should all do — and what I think the media should do aside from giving them a passing mention — is to ignore them. Because if it’s only white supremacists doing these “soooooo stupid” things, then the media is helping spread their twisted message.
If someone is burning shoes for other reasons, calling them white supremacists might not go over too well and perhaps fuel the ongoing debacle regarding “fake news”.
Everyone, this is Disperser, who got upset when I dared to disagree with him and said this “Finally, take that “I’m a strong and unafraid person even if I am a woman” chip off your shoulder and treat people as potential equals at least until they prove themselves to be actual adversaries and/or people meriting your contempt.” here: https://dispersertracks.com/2018/09/04/oh-whatever-shall-we-do/
I would, in fact, appreciate feedback on the evolving of the conversation and where I could have improved my conduct.
One tiny correction; I didn’t disagree with clubshadenfreude. I think that much, at least, is clear.
Please start new comments instead of replying directly to other comments as the nesting makes it difficult knowing who’s responding to what.
Start the comment with @NAME (example @ DispicableDisperser) otherwise it’s difficult keeping track of who said what.
I’ll try and respond to all comments, but please at least attempt to address specific aspects of the conversation. If you just want to wave the clubshadenfreude flag, back it up with something otherwise I might not bother to answer.
Again, I’ll only respond to comments about the evolving of the conversation in the comments.
I look forward to suggestions on how to improve myself.
I believe this doesn’t support your case “ClubSchadenfreude, I do agree with Andrew that this comment is needlessly provocative. Having read your About page, I dare say you would not accept this, frankly, trollish statement unchallenged on your blog.
While one might argue a relationship between some white supremacists and a particular religion, the primary argument there would be against supremacy arguments (of any race or belief). If wanting to be narrower in focus, one could argue the particular interpretation of religious scriptures as being faulty.
It should be clear Andrew’s comment is not intended to excuse religious beliefs even when applied to the extreme.”
Again, that’s questioning your approach and tone and not the argument itself. If you are reading that differently, then I agree I’m at fault for not expressing it in a way that you could understand.
That said, despite English being my second language, I’m fairly confident in my understanding of the meaning and message of the words you quote based on their arrangement and usage. Even if we don’t agree, at no point did I challenge the notion that unfounded and odious beliefs should be challenged.
In fact, there’s a rather lengthy exchange between Andrew and myself with me specifically making the same argument you make (but, of course — and in my opinion — better and less confrontationally).
In that regard, you might also consider not cherry picking stuff and presenting it context, but this being your blog, your rules apply.
So what is your first language, and again, always nice to see someone who claims this, having no problem in telling me about what an uppity woman I supposedly am for daring to disagree with you and not obeying what you insisted what the only right way to debate.
And funny how I did present it in context and gave the link to the whole thing. You might want to consider that, before making yet more false claims which you do not like challenged..
I don’t know if you are here in the US or not, since you said English was your second language. You mention the “the many people of color” who don’t agree with what you call disrespecting the flag, by kneeling during the pledge and the anthem. Now, who are these people you claim exist? I’m asking since I have not seen any doing this. They may be, but I’ve not seen a single one and wonder where you have.
We also have the issue that those people who don’t like the protest, when asked what they want the players to do to protest, they by and large have no answer. They have no suggestions other than “not while I’m watching”. However, any time we see protests, we have people insisting that it’s not the “right” time or “right” place. It’s very reminiscent of how people who want to have military weapons insist that it is never the “right” time or place to discuss gun violence. They simply don’t want to hear that they are wrong.
Like in our interaction, you often don’t like it if someone dares to not protest or discuss, etc if it is not to your personal liking, and it is not terribly surprising that you would try the “not right time and place” argument. I’m my case, you want to claim I’m not discussing “correctly”. And you also try to claim again that anyone who disagrees with you is not wanting to understand and discuss the many issues related to the original controversy. It’s a great way to try to discount people who disagree with you, a lie told to try to misrepresent them, often known as poisoning the well.
Funny how I provided a link to the flag code. But it seems that you ignored it intentionally. And yes, it says that the code doesn’t have the authority to issue official rulings. So? We have idiots who want to claim that burning the flag is just so very awful, using that same code, and then ignoring it when convenient for them when it comes to other parts of the code. They are hypocrites and it seems that you may be too, Disp, in your thoughtless defense of these people.
These people who have a fit when a black man kneels to protest injustice on the field only want to use the code when convenient for them, Disp. And yes, that makes them bigots, wannabee nazis and wannabee confederates. As I have pointed out, these are the people who also want to fly the battle flag of an enemy of the US who wanted to murder people so they could own others, these are the ones who don’t want to see that they are wrong.
They protest anyone who dares not agree with them, and they don’t want a black man’s face on Nike because that again shows them that they are wrong. And yep, those shoes could help someone, but these wannabee nazis and confederates and bigots don’t think beyond having a tantrum because someone dares stand up to them and dares to point out that the US isn’t perfect. Yep, people want to do something when they are upset that someone doesn’t agree with them, and this is one of those things.
To say that someone you don’t like should be ignored, doesn’t work and it never has. How well do you think it worked when people said that Hitler wasn’t a problem? It’s a poor idea and not much different than saying “let everyone do what they do since it isn’t my problem” that Andrew advocated. It’s also interesting that you don’t seem to think that white supremacists do “soooo stupid things”. The media isn’t spreading their message, though that does occur; they expose it, and counter it. And you aren’t sure what sides there are in this discussion? That seems to be a bit disingenuous, Disp, as do your words that we shouldn’t do anything because we don’t know what someone might be paying attention to.
You present a lot of what ifs, to excuse these people, Disp. Why else do people burn shoes, please do provide some examples. I call bigots who complain about a black man protesting injustice as I see them, and as how they act: wannabee nazis and confederates, white supremacists who want to pretend that they and only they have rights.
For your questions, “but what do I know?” well, it seems very little. And that’s always a pathetic way to try to imply that no one knows as much as you or is as wise as you. Oh the poor martyr.
A corpse has mor right over their dead body than a pregnant woman. At least pregnant girls here in Washington are immediately emancipated. Alabama should just go ahead an dissolve the border with Mississippi.
Any opinions on undergarments, swimwear and so forth with American flags on them? I do believe there are even jockstraps – when will the protests begin?
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We also have idiots who are claiming to support other shoe companies because they have athletic shoes with the US flag on them. Now, lest we forget, that isn’t supposed to happen and these wannabee white supremacists don’t even what the US Flag Code says, and heck most of them want to fly a flag with a swastika on it or the battle flag of a country that decided to kill their fellow citizens because they wanted to own people and allow people to own other people in the new territories.
Club Schadenfreude 
I might be wrong (I often am) but didn’t the USA Olympic Teams wear a flag symbol on their kit? Also the USA National Soccer Team? I didn’t know that there was a ‘Flag Code’. Boy, that’s weird!
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it isn’t unusual for people to have no idea about the code. But one would think that these uberpatriots would know especially since they know about the flag burning part. And pretty much at any conservative rally, some idiot has a flag shirt, flag halter top, etc on .
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In UK it is possible to buy almost anything with the Union Flag on it. You guys are a lot more sensitive about the flag thing than we are!
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I suspect we are not. But you know, it does come with that “let’s enslave people” bullshit.
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While I agree the reaction to Nike’s decision is at best misguided, there are things I might point out . . .
Not everyone who disagrees with “taking the knee” is a white supremacist and implying so does a disservice to the many persons of color who — for their own reasons — don’t agree with disrespecting a flag, including not standing during the anthem.
What’s at the heart of the discussion for them is the method, time, and place of the protest and not so much discounting the issue itself.
I know, I know . . . it’s convenient lumping everything together as it cuts down having to understand and discuss the many issues related to the original controversy.
Second, you mention the Flag Code, but you might have provided the link (http://www.usflag.org/uscode36.html) and perhaps point out this oft-overlooked fact:
*While the Code empowers the President of the United States to alter, modify, repeal or prescribe additional rules regarding the Flag, no federal agency has the authority to issue ‘official’ rulings legally binding on civilians or civilian groups.*
Little more than a “suggestion” to civilians, the code is strictly enforced by the armed forces within the armed forces and thus their negative reactions to the misuse of the flag or disrespect aimed at the flag — by no means universal — is certainly not because they are “nazis” or white supremacists.
So it is with the burning of Nike shoes; it’s done for different reasons by different people. Yes, it’s stupid if for no other reason that there are homeless people who could use those shoes and many of those homeless are, in fact, veterans.
While I’m not big on any of these demonstrations, I do recognize that when people feel strongly about something, they want to “do” something.
How that something is received will vary depending on the views of the person who chooses to pay attention . . . and most people have a narrow attention span driving them to over-react about everything. A perfect brew for irrational temper-flaring on both sides of . . . well, I’m not sure what, really; like I said, many issues at play here and one never knows what an individual is actually paying attention to.
Personally, I do what I think we should all do — and what I think the media should do aside from giving them a passing mention — is to ignore them. Because if it’s only white supremacists doing these “soooooo stupid” things, then the media is helping spread their twisted message.
If someone is burning shoes for other reasons, calling them white supremacists might not go over too well and perhaps fuel the ongoing debacle regarding “fake news”.
But, what do I know?
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Everyone, this is Disperser, who got upset when I dared to disagree with him and said this “Finally, take that “I’m a strong and unafraid person even if I am a woman” chip off your shoulder and treat people as potential equals at least until they prove themselves to be actual adversaries and/or people meriting your contempt.” here: https://dispersertracks.com/2018/09/04/oh-whatever-shall-we-do/
This does give context to his post. &)
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Thank you for the linking the post.
I would, in fact, appreciate feedback on the evolving of the conversation and where I could have improved my conduct.
One tiny correction; I didn’t disagree with clubshadenfreude. I think that much, at least, is clear.
Please start new comments instead of replying directly to other comments as the nesting makes it difficult knowing who’s responding to what.
Start the comment with @NAME (example @ DispicableDisperser) otherwise it’s difficult keeping track of who said what.
I’ll try and respond to all comments, but please at least attempt to address specific aspects of the conversation. If you just want to wave the clubshadenfreude flag, back it up with something otherwise I might not bother to answer.
Again, I’ll only respond to comments about the evolving of the conversation in the comments.
I look forward to suggestions on how to improve myself.
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I find it ridiculous that you now try to claim you don’t disagree with me when you tried the uppity woman crap.
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Well, people have different things they find ridiculous. I’m just glad to contribute to the general hilarity.
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Just to clarify, did not once disagree with your argument. Just your argument style.
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I believe this doesn’t support your case “ClubSchadenfreude, I do agree with Andrew that this comment is needlessly provocative. Having read your About page, I dare say you would not accept this, frankly, trollish statement unchallenged on your blog.
While one might argue a relationship between some white supremacists and a particular religion, the primary argument there would be against supremacy arguments (of any race or belief). If wanting to be narrower in focus, one could argue the particular interpretation of religious scriptures as being faulty.
It should be clear Andrew’s comment is not intended to excuse religious beliefs even when applied to the extreme.”
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Again, that’s questioning your approach and tone and not the argument itself. If you are reading that differently, then I agree I’m at fault for not expressing it in a way that you could understand.
That said, despite English being my second language, I’m fairly confident in my understanding of the meaning and message of the words you quote based on their arrangement and usage. Even if we don’t agree, at no point did I challenge the notion that unfounded and odious beliefs should be challenged.
In fact, there’s a rather lengthy exchange between Andrew and myself with me specifically making the same argument you make (but, of course — and in my opinion — better and less confrontationally).
In that regard, you might also consider not cherry picking stuff and presenting it context, but this being your blog, your rules apply.
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So what is your first language, and again, always nice to see someone who claims this, having no problem in telling me about what an uppity woman I supposedly am for daring to disagree with you and not obeying what you insisted what the only right way to debate.
And funny how I did present it in context and gave the link to the whole thing. You might want to consider that, before making yet more false claims which you do not like challenged..
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You are right; I have no idea why I’m even trying. It’s not like I gain anything from it.
Sorry for the intrusion.
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You may come or go as you want. I will address your longer post tomorrow.
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By the way, clubshadenfreude, if you rather I don’t contribute here, ask, and I’ll refrain from commenting.
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please comment as much or as little as you would like. I’ll address your earlier comments as I have time.
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Now that Ford has come out in support of the protests I want to see these people burning their pickups.
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so do I. I want to see a few ridiculously large pickup trucks up in flames.
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Disp,
I don’t know if you are here in the US or not, since you said English was your second language. You mention the “the many people of color” who don’t agree with what you call disrespecting the flag, by kneeling during the pledge and the anthem. Now, who are these people you claim exist? I’m asking since I have not seen any doing this. They may be, but I’ve not seen a single one and wonder where you have.
We also have the issue that those people who don’t like the protest, when asked what they want the players to do to protest, they by and large have no answer. They have no suggestions other than “not while I’m watching”. However, any time we see protests, we have people insisting that it’s not the “right” time or “right” place. It’s very reminiscent of how people who want to have military weapons insist that it is never the “right” time or place to discuss gun violence. They simply don’t want to hear that they are wrong.
Like in our interaction, you often don’t like it if someone dares to not protest or discuss, etc if it is not to your personal liking, and it is not terribly surprising that you would try the “not right time and place” argument. I’m my case, you want to claim I’m not discussing “correctly”. And you also try to claim again that anyone who disagrees with you is not wanting to understand and discuss the many issues related to the original controversy. It’s a great way to try to discount people who disagree with you, a lie told to try to misrepresent them, often known as poisoning the well.
Funny how I provided a link to the flag code. But it seems that you ignored it intentionally. And yes, it says that the code doesn’t have the authority to issue official rulings. So? We have idiots who want to claim that burning the flag is just so very awful, using that same code, and then ignoring it when convenient for them when it comes to other parts of the code. They are hypocrites and it seems that you may be too, Disp, in your thoughtless defense of these people.
These people who have a fit when a black man kneels to protest injustice on the field only want to use the code when convenient for them, Disp. And yes, that makes them bigots, wannabee nazis and wannabee confederates. As I have pointed out, these are the people who also want to fly the battle flag of an enemy of the US who wanted to murder people so they could own others, these are the ones who don’t want to see that they are wrong.
They protest anyone who dares not agree with them, and they don’t want a black man’s face on Nike because that again shows them that they are wrong. And yep, those shoes could help someone, but these wannabee nazis and confederates and bigots don’t think beyond having a tantrum because someone dares stand up to them and dares to point out that the US isn’t perfect. Yep, people want to do something when they are upset that someone doesn’t agree with them, and this is one of those things.
To say that someone you don’t like should be ignored, doesn’t work and it never has. How well do you think it worked when people said that Hitler wasn’t a problem? It’s a poor idea and not much different than saying “let everyone do what they do since it isn’t my problem” that Andrew advocated. It’s also interesting that you don’t seem to think that white supremacists do “soooo stupid things”. The media isn’t spreading their message, though that does occur; they expose it, and counter it. And you aren’t sure what sides there are in this discussion? That seems to be a bit disingenuous, Disp, as do your words that we shouldn’t do anything because we don’t know what someone might be paying attention to.
You present a lot of what ifs, to excuse these people, Disp. Why else do people burn shoes, please do provide some examples. I call bigots who complain about a black man protesting injustice as I see them, and as how they act: wannabee nazis and confederates, white supremacists who want to pretend that they and only they have rights.
For your questions, “but what do I know?” well, it seems very little. And that’s always a pathetic way to try to imply that no one knows as much as you or is as wise as you. Oh the poor martyr.
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A corpse has mor right over their dead body than a pregnant woman. At least pregnant girls here in Washington are immediately emancipated. Alabama should just go ahead an dissolve the border with Mississippi.
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Any opinions on undergarments, swimwear and so forth with American flags on them? I do believe there are even jockstraps – when will the protests begin?
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well, pretty much any photographs of Trump’s minions will have one of these.
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Watch this clip, it´s from a drama about her which was absolutely amazing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7ANL0-cYYg
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now that’s the way to get a oven fixed 🙂
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