Not So Polite Dinner Conversation – a typical interaction with a Christian, presbyterian type.

Here’s a typical interaction with a Christian, Rev. A.P. McIntyre of Clogher Valley Free Presbyterian Church in Northern Ireland, made the usual claims that anyone but him and those who agree with him, are fools.  You can see a bit of our interaction below.  He is a Presbyterian, but as always, he’s part of what are called “free presbyterians”, another bit of evidence that Christianity is a fistful of splinters. I was a Presbyterian, it’s just as silly as any of the other versions of Christianity.

“Ok: we need to think clearly snd consider 4 very basic facts –
1: The credibility of the Bible. Can you or anyone disprove the factual narratives in Scripture? Archeology has confirmed numerous people, places, events – has anything been disproved? Take a wander through the British Museum and you will discover evidence of the Ur of the Chaldees, Babylon, Nebuchadnezzar, Cyrus, Assyria, Nineveh, Ahab and others. You dismiss the Bible too lightly in your quest to deny there is a God.”

So much for claims of “facts”.

1.  The bible is not credible in any way. There are many bible scholars and myself who can show that your myths are false.  Archaeology has not supported the essential claims of the bible at all.  There is no evidence for any of the supposed god caused events, including the world-wide 28,000+ foot deep flood, babel, the exodus, the battles of hundreds of thousands of combattants, any of the events in the gospels, or any of paul’s claims like him going to rome. 

Archaeology has supported that jews used ritual baths, that some of the people mentioned in the bible existed and that some of the places existed.  If this is “evidence” for your god, then we have evidence that Athena and Poseidon are real, that the Egyptian gods are real, etc since those myths also mention real places and people. It also is “evidence” that Spider-man is real and the Avengers are real since both comic books and movies mention real places and people. 

“2: Looking at the Bible as a whole the central theme which unites the book argues for its veracity. God spoke of a Redeemer in Eden, the family out of which He would be born was identified through Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Judah & David. At the heart of the Redeemer’s work was death by sacrifice. This theme runs from the death of the first animal sacrifices in Eden, to the Leviticus code, the Passover, the Day of Atonement and it climaxed on the cross. One dying for another may seem difficult for you I admit But Jesus Christ was the willing substitute for us. He was not forced. He did it out of pure love. The cross was the greatest demonstration of both justice and mercy in the history of the world. This theme is woven into the fabric of the Bible by numerous authors over a 1500 year time frame. There is a miraculous consistency throughout.”

2.  Nope, the bible isn’t a whole, and has no “central theme”, so your claims of these thing that don’t exist as evidence for its veracity fails.  God did not speak of jesus in eden, there is no evidence for that at all.  What we have in eden is an amazingly ignorant god, who made amoral humans, then threw a tantrum when those humans were amoral and listened to snake/satan who this god either allowed into the garden or couldn’t keep it out.  I think it’s hilarious when Christians try to claim that jesus was part of the “us” in genesis with no evidence at all.  The baseless claim in John also fails since there is no evidence from the Jews themselves that they ever thought this was true. 

Unfortunately, for chrsitians, what they lie and claim as prophecy for their jesus was for the jewish messiah, a position that jesus fails rather pitifully.  Happily, I don’t need a scapegoat to be tortured to death for my actions.  I’m responsible for them, no one else.  I find it disgusting that Christians are so selfish and greedy. 

Nope, no love, just a rather peculiar god that demands blood and pain to make itself happy.  No one but this god wanted this disgusting nonsense. 

Unsurprisingly, there is no “miraculous consistency” in your bible with Christians unable to agree on how one is saved, what this god wants for morals, what heaven and hell are, how to interpret the bible, etc.  Then we have Paul contradicting jesus repeatedly, so I’m not impressed.  I suggest googling “Paul contradicts Jesus  voiceofjesus”  to see a very nice list of the contradictions shown by one of your fellow Christians.

“3: The Jewish people are a fact. A colleague of mine was an atheist who thought as you do. He was convinced of the truth of Christianity by the presence of the Jews. No people have experienced the hatred, persecution and genocide like the Jews. They are the most ancient people in the world; they have lost their nationhood on more than one occasion only to have it recovered. They received a particular blessing through Abraham their Father which argues for their preservation.”

3.  Yep, the jewish people are a fact.  So are believers in Allah, believers in Wakan Tanka, believers in the various Hindu gods, etc. That is not evidence that those gods are real. 

Your friend was an idiot if he was so ignorant to think that since the jews exist, some god must exist.  Yep, plenty of cults are abused, and funny how Christians are one of the worst anti-semitic movements ever, with your need for all jews to be converted or dead for your end times fantasies.  Jews aren’t even remotely the most ancient people in the world.  Your ignorance is sadly typical of a christain who must lie to support his cult. 

No god preserved the jews, they did it themselves. If their god supposedly is “preserving” them, then it is a complete incompetent moron when it came to the Holocaust/Shoah.

“4: Ultimately, all I can show you is the evidence, which points to the existence of God, but I cannot scientifically prove there is a God anymore than you can scientifically prove there is not a God. I suppose that creates a stalemate except for this one fact…we both have faith…Mine rests in a God who gives me peace and happiness and hope…your faith in your atheistic secularism. In both cases we have made what we consider rationale choices but yet they both rest on faith. My choice rests in a Saviour who died and rose again for me. That in itself sets Christianity apart – resurrection gives hope in a world of death. What does your faith do for you, what hope does it provide you with?”

Ultimately, you can’t show me any evidence and all of your claims are baseless as I have demonstrated above.  You can’t show your god exists scientifically when you should be able to.  There should be plenty of evidence.  Every single self-proclaimed christain should be able to do what the bible has your jesus promising to them.  Funny how not one of you can.  What’s wrong? The bible lies?  You lie? 

Alas, imaginary nonsense can never be shown to exist.  This god “once upon a time’ had no problem at all giving evidence.  Curious how it can’t anymore.

Happily, I do not have faith, I have trust in observed facts.  That is not the same as playing pretend that some imaginary powerful being agrees with me, but strangely does nothing at all.

Your cult rests on a need to pretend that anyone who dares not agree with you deserves death and worse.  It gives hope that your sadistic fantasies will come true.

Sine I have no faith, your question is simply a lie, an attempt to force me to agree with your lie.  Oh tsk, you fail.  My worldview, mostly epicureanism, give me hope since people are basically good, and that if we worth together, enjoy life, etc, we can achieve great things.  This isn’t a “world of death’.  You just have a death cult, desperately wishing for death so you can get your magical prezzies, wishing for the death of others so you get your revenge on them for them not giving you the external validation you crave. 

I’m very happy not to be part of such nonsense anymore.