Not So Polite Dinner Conversation – a response to Dale re: prayer and free will

021-you-burnt-us-at-the-stake-650x402(10/20/2016 – I’ve had a lot of Christians follow recently and like this post, as well as other posts about how religion fails.  Not sure why this is, but I’m more than happy to see people approve and agree with my posts.)

I’ve encountered a new Christian apologist on a friend’s website.  I’ll first put up his post and give a little background.  Ark has asked Christians to explain a couple of things in their religion.  SailorDale has said he would do so, with some caveats.  I’m not sure if he will answer or not (and I’m assuming he is a he.)   We went off topic a little and I thought I’d post here to not take up time and space on another’s blog.  Now, for my readers who have been around for a while, this is more making of the pate de cheval and yep, you’ve see the discussion before.

Sailordale writes: OK, First let me say that you have the choice (free will) to accept or reject Jesus. Ultimately, that is your decision, and yours alone. Everyone has some knowledge of God, and thus no one will be without excuse when we are standing before God to give an account for our lives. We will not be able to say “I didn’t know” So I do hope that you will seriously consider Christianity! And I highly recommend the page- http://www.gotquestions.org/ That is a great place to seek answers to your unresolved questions about God & Jesus. And the Bible is the best interpreter of itself. Keep on reading it, the answers are all there. And as for the Prayers- Yes, Prayer DOES work, and all prayers will be answered! But, they may not be answered exactly as the asker is wanting. You are misunderstanding the prayers that you mentioned in your post. Never did Jesus say that all our prayers would be granted as we wish. We must pray according to God’s Will. If we pray for something that is against the will of God, that prayer will always be answered with a NO. God knows us better than we know ourselves, and He will not give us something that will not good for us. And if your mind is set on not becoming a Christian, then God will NEVER force Himself on anyone! That choice is yours. God knows everything, past, present, & future. If He knows that one will never accept Him, and His Son’s payment for all sins, then God will leave you alone. God knows all that are His, and not a single one of His will be lost. God most certainly DOES exist, and He Loves YOU more than anyone can comprehend! He also knows if you will accept or reject Him in the future. (He knows your choice, and He will honor your choice, whatever you chose…”

Free will

Dale, your reply indicates that you don’t know what the bible says and that is not an uncommon thing when it comes to Christians.  Where in the bible does it say one has the free will to accept or reject Jesus?  I’m very familiar with the bible, having read it in its entirety as a Christian and as not, and I don’t recall where it says there is free will.  You are most welcome to show me wrong.  I do remember where it says that God chooses some people to believe and some people not to believe (Romans 9) and where the character JC says that he/his god intentionally makes it impossible for some to accept and understand his words. This would not indicate free will.  There are also the many instances of this god interfering with humans which also indicates no free will (I’m going with the often used definition that we somehow can make decisions and act without influence of any kind or at least no superpowereful divine influences).   Considering that this god controlled the actions of many e.g. Pharoah, and removed the choices from many e.g. David’s son, there is again no evidence for free will. Perhaps you define free will differently. Please do explain. Continue reading

Not So Polite Dinner Conversation – and one more instance of Christians telling just a little lie, Franklin Graham

Franklin Graham,  the son of Billy Graham, famous American Christian evangelist, was in Harrisburg today.   It was part of his tour insisting that one needs to pray for America.  He didn’t endorse a candidate, but it’s not hard to know who he wants to win, mostly because he has said it himself despites the claims to the contrary “Asked whether Mr Trump might be his preferred candidate, Rev Graham told ABC’s “This Week” program: “Sure, yes.”

“When I first saw that he was getting in, I thought, well, this has got to be a joke,” Rev Graham said. “But the more you listen to him, the more you say to yourself, you know, maybe this guy’s right.”

The same kind of person like himself, who makes false claims about how horrible things are in the US,  about the president of the US, and who is sure that making the US a Christian theocracy is just a peachy idea.

Graham, true to form, was ginning up more fear.

“If we’re not careful, we’re going to lose our religious freedom anyway, so we might as well go ahead and get people out there and vote and get them to vote by the busloads,” he said. “Make sure people are registered in their churches, and I’m talking about registered. Get your grandparents, your children, grandchildren; just don’t go to the graveyard and start digging up your ancestors. Don’t do that. People have done that. That’s not right. Anybody of legal age, get them out there to vote.”

Because, you know,  being persecuted for being Christian and losing your religious freedom looks exactly like this. Hundreds, if not thousands of Christians standing in a state owned park created to honor military personnel,  right across from the state capitol building, in an area that has ten pages of churches in its yellow pages, in a country that has hundreds of media outlets devoted to Christianity.

photo from ABC27

photo from ABC27

 

 

Chalking

I like this… (reblogged from We Play Our Roll)

A friend of mine sent me this link and the associated video.
http://dailycaller.com/2016/09/13/ivy-league-student-brought-to-tears-by-trump-chalking-video/

His attitude was “Ha Ha, look at what wimps the young liberals are turning out to be.”

Well, I wasn’t sure what “chalking” was, although I had a pretty good idea.  A little research brought up this: from another campus where chalking occurred.

http://college.usatoday.com/2016/04/09/chalking-pro-trump-messages-set-off-storms/

“Also on April 5, chalk messages were written on the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign campus. They included, “They have to go back #Trump,” “Build the Wall” and “Trump Deportation Force.”

The messages appeared near the campus’ Latina/Latino Studies building.”

Chalking is not the exchange of ideas, it’s done to intimidate.
This is not just pro trump, the messages and locations are not an accident.
Hate speech should be distinguished from free speech.
Lets not forget that the Hitler youth were fond of scrawling slogans on walls…
“Wir hassen die Juden und Ausländer”…

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