Just another found post by christians regarding atheists, and their attempts to gin up fear to keep people in the cult and to try to scare people into joining this cult. It’s from quite a website, “The Orthosphere” which claims:
“We are Christians: Catholic, Protestant and Orthodox. We believe our religion is true, and we take the Bible and the Church Fathers as our guides to the faith. We do not innovate religiously, for that is folly.
We affirm our respective traditions where they disagree with the other branches of Christianity, but we do so respectfully, for we have much in common (catholic or mere christianity ) and our enterprise has as much to do with society as with religion.
Socio-politically, we can be called “traditionalist conservatives” or “Christian reactionaries.” Since we agree that Modernity—the fundamental principle of contemporary Western Civilization—is radically defective, we are branded “far-right.” In truth, we affirm what was regarded as self-evident by the vast majority of mankind until well into the Twentieth Century: Religion is true, authority is valid and good, man and woman differ in essential ways, and so on. If affirming reality puts us at the rightmost end of the political spectrum, as the world construes politics, then so be it.
We recognize that the societies of the West are radically disordered, and it is our desire that they move toward a more proper order, one which acknowledges Christianity. Although we are Christians, our primary concern here is not with how individual souls are to be saved from the wrath of God, but rather with how society ought to be ordered. Therefore both Christians and friendly non-Christians are welcome at the Orthosphere.”
funny how these christians claim each other are wrong consistently and each claism the others are going to hell. So much for “respect”. I guess fear makes strange bedfellows yet again. BTW, there is no such thing as “mere christianity”, nonsense invented by C.S. Lewis who said:
“I should have been out of my depth in such waters: more in need of help myself than able to help others. And secondly, I think we must admit that the discussion of these disputed points has no
tendency at all to bring an outsider into the Christian fold. So long as we write and talk about them we are much more likely to deter him from entering any Christian communion than to draw him into our own. Our divisions should never be discussed except in the presence of those who have already come to believe that there is one God and that Jesus Christ is His only Son.” – Mere Christianity, preface
Nothing like a good lie to try to make sure someone can’t make an informed decision. These christians are each quite sure only their versions is the truth.
as usual, little new here.
Here’s part of the post I found, by a “kristor”, who has appeared on this blog before. He’s quite the messed up little fellow. :
“A thought as we approach the end of the Thanksgiving season: honest consistent atheists can’t believe there is anyone to whom thanks for the blessings of this our life and its world are owed, or from whom any goods are derived. Indeed, they can’t consistently believe that there are any objective goods in the first place, let alone blessings; they can believe only in specious goods – in idiotic goods (solipsistic goods, i.e., which as such are idiosyncratic, and that as nowise ordered under any Logos are therefore idiopathic). In a world ordered only by happenstance, there can be no other sort – including the good of order, and the good of understanding, which on atheism must too be specious.”
It’s nothing new to see these typical false claims by christians. Atheism is not nihilism, so they fail immediately. No one needs their imaginary god to know what good is. This is a typical attempt by a christian to try to scare people into joining their religion by lying. A rather curious tactic by people who claim to worship a god that hates lies and liars.
There is no evidence of any objective good, and one would have to wonder how these christians would demonstrate that. What we see from christians is a range of claims of what this god of theirs wants when it comes to morals. They can’t agree, nor can they show their god merely exists.
This range of claims shows that christian morality is subjective. The other way we can see that christianity morality is subjective is that christians must excuse their god when it does things that, hopefully, they would find horrible if a human did the same. This shows their morality is dependent on, e.g. subject to, who someone is, not a system of where a moral is always associated with an action.
That there is no objective good doesn’t mean there is no good. Humans determine morality, not some imaginary being. This also means that atheists, and other non-christians, can be thankful to real people and things, no imaginary nonsense needed.
it’s also rather funny how the author tries to use big words and gets them wrong. Material objects can’t be solipsistic or idiopathic or idiosyncratic or specious. The attempt by the christian to seem educated fails.
“I do not of course mean to suggest that men who style themselves atheists do not indeed feel gratitude, or any others of the loving feelings. Apart from the psychopaths among them, they do. What I mean to suggest rather is that any man who does honestly feel any of the loving feelings cannot be both a consistent and an honest atheist. He must be faking something or other, not just to others, but even to himself; most likely his atheism.
Notwithstanding all that, a Happy Thanksgiving to all who encounter this text, whether or not they truly believe in Thanksgiving.”
Of course, he means to try to lie about atheists. He simply fails miserably.
Happily, no one needs a christian’s imaginary friend to feel love, gratitude, etc. The only one here faking anything is the christian. As usual, the chrsitian has to desperately claim that there are no atheists, since he is terrified of anyone who doesn’t need his god, or more appropriately, him.
Update 11/27/23: poor Kristor, trying to be so impressive, and ending up with no more than a word salad as his “response“. All of that incoherences and still no evidence for objective morality *or* his imaginary friend.
Update 11/28: poor Kristor and his little friend JM. It’s great to see them fail, and show how that they are indeed terrified since my posts just never seem to get out of moderation. I’ve entertained myself by making a pdf of their comments, which are filled with excuses about how they just have such wonderful rebuttals but can’t show what they are.
update 12/4/23: and another pdf of their comments
Club Schadenfreude 
Funny. When my husband and I were active Christians, our denomination was the only true one. (We did admit that there were Christians in other denominations though.) The Catholic Church was the mark of the beast etc etc.
Now, these Christian nationalists, who want to order society in THEIR far right conservative beliefs, have closed ranks. I wonder how long they would stay friendly if one of their divisions were in charge. Would they continue to be friendly, or would they continue to tighten the grip of their particular cult. Because true Protestants think Catholicism is a combination of pagan beliefs and Christianity. And Catholics believe that the Orthodox are heretics, while Protestants are really out there.
Still, it could be that power would work for a time. Especially since money and power are certainly attractive to those who want to screw over the rest of us.
Finally, we know what they are really protesting. They are against LGBTQ+ people having rights, women having medical rights to make their own decisions, non-whites having the right to not be summarily executed by the upholders of money and power (the police), and protecting the truly vulnerable: the poor, the physically and emotionally disabled, and non-radical conservative Christians. When they say family they exclude all kind and caring and loving non-cisgender relationships. When they say family they exclude trans and non-binary people. When they say family they mean women being submissive to their men.
This is their world and we have to fight them as best we can.
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if these idiots didn’t have someone to hate, they’d be attacking each other. A religious war would start the moment that any particular sect got power over the others.
Personally, I feel it is not their world at all, and they are already failing. I’ll always fight against their ignorance and hate.
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Is there a cult that doesn’t depend on fear?
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good point. i’m guessing not.
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Still, an interesting read. Good to be reminded.
I have never liked the term “atheism” but I have no immediate equivalent. “non-believers” maybe.
Anyway, it’s very difficult to explain “atheism” to a believer. But there are many good books and more then some useful blogs, but only those beginning to doubt are likely to read them.
I don’t think they are trying to hurt our feelings, I suspect they are trying to deter their own from leaving. Even CSL did want us reading his stuff because he wrote it for them.
Thanks for the reminder and happy Sunday. 🙂
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thanks, Bill. I agree, it’s not to hurt feelings, (if it is, it fails miserably) but just pure ignorance and fear
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It is funny how people keep trying to tell us what atheists and atheism are all about. 🙂
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“Now that’s a level of stupid I have not seen in a long time” sums it up. The arrogance and ignorance of the religious never ceases to amaze me.
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it certainly is amazing. and I always wonder just how I could have bought into it for so long.
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Very good post. The level of dishonesty from these so-called x-ians is pretty much what got me to thinking it’s all bullshit. To borrow from one of the memes, “it was all downhill from there.”
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“Atheist” is not an identity. And so, when one is said not to be an atheist because “unprincipled exception,” this IS NOT an actual attack on one’s identity.
An “atheist” denies Perfection. This is the “non-believer” aspect of atheism. The “atheist” does not believe in the Reality of Perfection. And it is this non-belief/denial which CANNOT be a foundation of any solid identity AS ALL solid identities are founded upon “being right all of the time,” ie., being perfect .
No identity is founded upon being wrong — even a little — UNLESS there is an agent desirous of degeneracy and self-annihilation.
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Hi TD. IT’s hilarous when you claim atheist isn’t an identity. Always fun when christian think they can declare something unilaterally, and in TD’s case, incoherently.
“1a: the distinguishing character or personality of an individual : INDIVIDUALITY
b: the relation established by psychological identification
2: the condition of being the same with something described or asserted
establish the identity of stolen goods
3a sameness of essential or generic character in different instances
b: sameness in all that constitutes the objective reality of a thing : ONENESS” merriam webster.
i, as an atheist, have concluded that your god doesn’t exist since there is no evidence of it. It is not “perfection” in any sense. And as always, poor TD can’t show his god merely exists or that I am wrong.
TD is the poster child for ignorant christians who think they are “sophisticated theologians” and “philosophers”. He simply makes things up and tries so hard to use big words to make his nonsense seem viable.
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Dude…
Do you or do you not reject objective Supremacy, ie., The Reality of Perfection?
And is this rejection not at the “heart” of your “atheism” aka your identity?
What are the repercussions of grounding an identity in the rejection of Perfection?
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nothing is perfect, dear, most especially your idiot god. You can’t even show perfection exists, dear, so your entire line of bullshit fails.
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[N]othing is perfect — CS
This is exactly the belief which leads the atheist, inexorably, towards an ideologically-induced self-annihilation.
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and more blithering from you, TD. Sorry, no “self-annihilation”, just the lies of a christian who needs to try to gin up fear for his cult.
of course, TD still can’t show his imaginary friend exists, or that there is any “perfection”.
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You just claimed above that “nothing” is perfect. Psychologically, this translates into “being nothing” is perfect. Ergo, “not existing” is perfect. In other words, annihilation is perfect. Meaning, self-annihilation is perfect.
“Final Liberation” is the core desire of the atheist.
Self-annihilation is the manner in which the atheist “falsifies” Creation.
So… Own it and quit using these weak diatribes against “christianity” as an aggressive cover for your own brand of belief in “perfection.”
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and TD shows yet again just how much of an idiot he is. It’s just great to see a christian lie and try to twist words to get what he wants. There is no magical “psychological translation”, that’s just more BS that this poor fellow has invented.
Nope, annhilation isn’t perfect, and this idiot can’t even define “perfect”. I, as an atheist, do not desire “final liberation” whatever that means. It’s just more BS from a christian liar.
Annihilating myself would not falsify anything.
And still no evidence for this cultist’s imaginary friend.
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CS…
It appears that *you* are female first and “atheist” only as egalitarian cover.
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(reaches for Clue-by-Four™)
*BONK*
Nice “witness,” Thordaddy. Do you kiss your Messiah with that mendacious, misogynistic mouth?
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poor TD, he has nothing so he chooses a typical misogyny. And again, we get to see him use words that he has no idea what they mean.
egalitarian: asserting, promoting or marked by a belief in human equality especially with respect to social, political, and economic affairs
2: a social philosophy advocating the removal of inequalities among people
I do wonder what an “egalitarian cover” is supposed to mean. It’s also great to see him randomly use quotation marks to no effect.
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Astreja…
You’re going to have to flesh that one out a little further so as to provide me the opportunity to comprehend what you are actually trying to state?
What’s your point?
My point is that for CS the “atheist” identity is secondary to the female identity when it comes to making claims on Reality.
Maybe that went over your head though?
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TD has no “point”. He makes incoherent comments and then tries to retroactively invent meaning for them. He made this claim “It appears that *you* are female first and “atheist” only as egalitarian cover.” which is meaningless, and then invents this “My point is that for CS the “atheist” identity is secondary to the female identity when it comes to making claims on Reality.” which is still meaningless.
it’s rather notable that this nitwit has claimed that atheist isn’t an identity, and now he claims it to be one.
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You have no way of reading minds, TD, so you’re out of line when you claim to know the hierarchy of someone else’s identities. Stop telling other people who they “really” are – it’s none of your business anyway.
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CS…
*You* and every atheist who argues for the “rightness” of atheism are the “proof” of the Reality of Perfection.
Again and again, *you* reveal your penchant for “being right all of the time.” In other words, *you* are motivated by the “lies” of “christians” to be perfect, ie., to be right all of the time vis-a-vis “christians.”
What further “proof” for Perfection do *you* require?
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and poor TD is back still making no sense at all. It’s great when he makes baseless declarations like “*You* and every atheist who argues for the “rightness” of atheism are the “proof” of the Reality of Perfection.”
So, dear, do show how we are this “proof” you natter about. It’s also great that a failure like you gets so upset when people show you to be wrong, whining about how dare they be right all of the time.
Sorry, the lies of christians don’t motivate me to be perfect. They motivate me to expose those lies. TD fails again.
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CS…
*You* are very slippery and possess a definitive method of deflecting any and all examination of the consequences of your belief in “non-belief.”
Yet, I should start from the beginning where *you* were obviously triggered by the idea that in “being thankful” (for whatever reason), *you* were NOT in accord with your atheist identity. In other words, wherever and whenever *you* find yourself thankful, *you* experience this NOT as an atheist, but as one who recognizes something higher that her self.
*You* haven’t made any sort of solid counter-argument to this claim.
But I digress…
I don’t believe “atheist” is an identity for the simple fact that such an “orientation” is not to be perfected. A truly solid identity fits perfectly. An identity that does not fit perfectly is doomed to annihilation.
*You* do not believe in Perfection, therefore, *you* cannot be in possession of a truly solid identity which fits perfectly. *You* have “atheism” instead and “it” is destined for destruction as a viable identity exactly because “it” just is not a perfect fit.
And I don’t sense *you* operating outside these axioms even when laid out in this kind of detail.
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and this idiot is back. I do love how he randomly puts quotes in, making no sense as usual. and he’s back to pretending he can read minds.
Alas, for poor TD, I can be thankful, just not to his imaginary friend, or to him. I experience this thankfulness to other people as an atheist, no matter what poor TD want to lie about.
I’ve shown how his god doesn’t exist, but again, cultists are hard to reason with.
TD claimed that atheism was an identity, and now is back trying to claim he doesn’t. He cannot show any perfection exists, nor that having a idenity requires it to be able to be perfected. that is simply made up nonsense on his part. My idenity is quite fine, no annihilation to be seen. that need for claiming annihilation seems to be what poor TD wants for anyone who dares show him wrong.
I don’t believe in perfection. And that doesn’t mean I can’t have a solid identity. Like all of TD’s claims, he simply makes assertions and has nothing to back them up. This is quite similar to his assertions about his religion. These poor cultists seem to think that people must believe their lies, no matter what. That, happily, is not the case. Atheism isn’t destined for destruction at all. That also comes from his cult.
An axiom: “An axiom, postulate, or assumption is a statement that is taken to be true, to serve as a premise or starting point for further reasoning and arguments.”
Poor TD, as usual, he has no idea what the words he uses mean, so he fails again with this one. An axiom is not always true.
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TD, you’re wrong when you say “An identity that does not fit perfectly is doomed to annihilation.”
That’s not how reality works. All we need is “fits well enough.” We don’t *need* perfection. We never did. We never will.
Does “imperfection” frighten you? Disgust you? If so, that sounds like an extreme form of religious scrupulosity and you are to be pitied – you won’t know the joy of just getting your hands dirty and mucking about with the messy clay of Real Life.
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