Not So Polite Dinner Conversation – external validation

hp-lovecraft-religion_thumbI’ve had two recent demonstrations of the need for external validation by theists. One on Mike’s website, where a woman, Emily Rose Lewis in comments, insisted that only she was right with her fantasies about her god. When her claims were demonstrated to be false, and she was asked for evidence, the threats fell fast and heavy. I was told that I should be grateful that her god was so “merciful” because if she was in charge she’d “fry” everyone who didn’t worship her god exactly as she did. If you want to “fry” someone, it certainly seems that you hate that someone, and people don’t often hate for no reason. They hate someone or something because it has or could take something away from them, something that they are afraid of losing.

In the second instance, there is much the same thing. Now, at this writing, this news story hasn’t been confirmed entirely. At a local school, in Carlisle, PA, a student was in the school nurse’s office when the morning pledge of allegiance was said. The student refused to participate in the pledge. The nurse’s reaction was (allegedly) “I don’t have to serve you.” (It seems that it was much worse, according to Hemant Mehta). A grown woman was threatened by the act of a girl, because she dared to not give the woman the external validation she needed. Now, could this woman be something else than a Christian? Perhaps, in another culture, but in Pennsylvania, that chance of her not being a Christian is no more than a snowball’s chance in hell (9th circle of hell, Dantean style, not included of course).

(Of course, there are many parallels to the instances where theists wish to invoke their religion so that they may pick and choose who to serve. It always makes me wonder how they would tell the difference among their clientele. What tests would they invoke to make sure their “morals” weren’t impinged?)

External validation is one of those things that humans love. We often learn from external validation, when someone tells us we did something correctly, be it a skill or a behavior desired in society.

In most, if not all, religions, external validation is very important to a certain subset, those who want to believe that they are the only right ones and, somewhat paradoxically, believe that they should never be questioned about their claims. One would think that such surety would invite questions.

This type of theist wants to be right and want no one else to know that they aren’t. They need constant agreement with them so they ceaselessly try to find those who will support their claims and who won’t question them. It often becomes very close to narcissism, especially when the theist is sure that God speaks to them and only them.

If the believer doesn’t get the attention and admiration that they think they deserve, they get downright nasty. The few things that are decent about religion go right out the window.   Their self-worth is entirely wrapped up in what they believe is true.   If they present their claims to a stranger confident that no one can question them, and that stranger says “no” or worse “no, and here’s why”, then it is an attack on their entire being. They are no longer the worthy, special “chosen” that they thought they were. If someone doesn’t ape their actions, then that person is a threat.

They find any action other than the one that they demand to be frightening. I think frightened is the best reason to explain why someone would act like so many theists do, be they Christian, Muslim, etc.

In my opinion, some of the actions of theists, the violence and intolerance based on fear, is symptomatic of the loss of certainty that theists once had. Where at one time religious differences were settled by the stake and the rack, they are now open discussion.   The respect and silence built out of fear and ignorance is failing.

When someone says “I don’t have to serve you.” Or that “If it were up to me Id have fried have the world by now.”, it does a lovely job of showing how much they are afraid of anyone different than they are and how much that fear inspires violence. These people wish the law to only allow those people like them to exist, wishing that the protections of the law only applied to them and no one else.  They wish to claim that the “other” isn’t in society, that they aren’t human.

14 thoughts on “Not So Polite Dinner Conversation – external validation

  1. “I don’t have to serve you” …. No, you don’t and you also don’t have to work here any longer, let’s go talk with your boss. Anyone that denies my child medical attention is going to court or suffer a summary judgement.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Unless, of course, when state’s give those special exemptions for delusions they approve of. Unfortunately there seems to be several.


    1. good question. I’ve come to the conclusion that it may have to do with people still believing the nonsense that the original very religious colonists did, that freedom only applies to a select few. They’ve deluded themselves with that idea and the sick nonsense of the myth of American exceptionalism.

      Liked by 1 person

    2. A theory I have thought plausible is that religiosity increases not automatically with poverty, but uncertainty. That if one is in an area that is subject to crime, that does not have socialized medicine, that employers can discharge you at a whim when there is not much in the way of financial assistance available. Given the increases in the cost of needs, the dismantling of safety nets, etc this new theory would now encompass the statistical outlier of the US over the old poverty equals religion theory.


  2. This is a great post, Val, and it hits on the thing we rarely talk about, but should: the threat we pose to theists because we won’t play along with their fantasy. This terrifies them. A lesson from history: be very careful of the hungry and/or terrified.


  3. It’s amazing how quickly the followers of “gentle Jesus, meek and mild” will abandon all pretense of civility when challenged to defend their position.


      1. Probably because she has a new book out. Which thread? (Btw, would it be possible to add a “recent comments” widget in the sidebar?)


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